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| Dale1990 | More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
 
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I finally got the hydraulics on the 90 straightened out thanks to everybody here (and a Phoenix Injector
 ) and now the 86 is acting up.The problem seems to be very similar. I am having trouble getting the shifter to engage gears. 3rd is the worst but the others are not far behind. Am I back to another hydraulic issue again or should I be looking at the linkage first? The car only has 50k miles on it although it did have a hard life before Dad bought it. The clutch fluid is black as night just like the 90 was... going to have add that to the standard maint. schedule. Do you think just doing a flush might bring it back? Thanks all! |
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Posted on: 2009/4/25 14:05
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| bogus | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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I would try that first. If the fluid is bad, it might be the cause.
I would also wonder if the bad fluid hasn't damaged one of the hyrdraulic components? What about the gear oil? Is it fresh and/or up to level? The linkage on the 4+3 is old school external manual linkage. I donno about adjustments, really. But a cleaning won't hurt, I suspect. If a bushing is bad, that could be a problem, too. At 50k miles, the clutch itself could be problem. But I would expect that to manifest itself not as a shifting problem, but as at slipping problem. |
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Posted on: 2009/4/25 17:25
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The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me |
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| Dale1990 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
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Gear oil and OD fluid were changed in the last 10k or so but I'll check the level - I didn't notice any leaks but better safe than sorry.
The clutch has been changed once before we got the car at ~35k miles. We had to replace the TOB once since then and the disc and FW looked fine at the time. I'll try bleeding/flushing the clutch hydraulics in the next day or so - maybe I'll get lucky for once . The brakes need a flushing too so I can get the big jug of fluid... yay.Thanks! |
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Posted on: 2009/4/25 18:24
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| BillH | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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The Stig Moderator
 
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One way to quick check the hydraulics is to put the car in first, on a flat surface, no brakes, and hold the clutch in for 30 seconds. If the m/c or slave is leaking, has air, etc, the car will start to creep forward.
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Posted on: 2009/4/26 16:12
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| Matatk | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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That's a good tip! I've never heard that before. Matthew |
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Posted on: 2009/4/26 16:25
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| BillH | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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The Stig Moderator
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Thanks, but it isn't mine. I think I may have read it on ZF Doc a long time ago. |
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Posted on: 2009/4/26 22:04
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| Dale1990 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
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Sorry it took so long to come back to this.
When I have it in gear with the clutch in it doesn't creep. It appears to start engaging an inch or two off the floor (didn't pay that close attention). I put her in the air to check the fluid levels since it does leak a little. The fluid in the manual side was white. It was Mobil 1 gear oil when it went in maybe 2 years ago. This was checked about 10 mins after I drove around in my driveway - no long trips. I'm guessing white gear oil is not normal. What could be doing that and how do I fix it?Thanks! |
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Posted on: 2009/5/30 16:47
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86 Coupe: SR 383 90 Convertible: Stock L98 06 Z06: Stock LS7 |
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| bogus | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Grand Imperial Pooh-Bah
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White gear oil? What's up with that?
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Posted on: 2009/5/31 2:49
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The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me |
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| Randyj75 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Guru Newb
 
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Sure you don't have water in the trans? That's what it sounds like. |
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Posted on: 2009/5/31 3:31
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| Calm | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
 
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White ANYTHING oil suggests condensation/water.
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Posted on: 2009/5/31 5:37
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| Dale1990 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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After doing some Googling, it seems water would be the most likely cause. The car hasn't been used as a U-boat so I guess it came from condensation. Seems like a lot of water for that but I haven't driven it a long time and we've had some very damp weather this year.
I dumped the white stuff out and put in some fresh gear oil. I'm tired of the leaking so I used non-synthetic. I took it for a spin and it seems a bit better but the original problem is still here. I still have trouble engaging gears. 1st has issues when starting from a stop. 3rd is not too happy, either. When downshifting, the problem exists in all gears. Not every shift has a problem but it happens far too often. |
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Posted on: 2009/5/31 9:24
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86 Coupe: SR 383 90 Convertible: Stock L98 06 Z06: Stock LS7 |
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| bogus | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Grand Imperial Pooh-Bah
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low engagement is a sign of a hydraulic problem, or a worn clutch.
I wonder if the master or slave are still not right. Have you tested the clutch condition? |
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Posted on: 2009/5/31 19:07
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The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me |
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| Dale1990 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
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Failing hydraulics seem to be a common theme on C4s so I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case. I might have mis-spoke on the engagement points - it doesn't 'feel' any different than normal.
How would I test the clutch condition? I doubt the disc is worn - I haven't noticed any slipping. Testing the hydraulics might be a good thing. |
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Posted on: 2009/5/31 19:37
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86 Coupe: SR 383 90 Convertible: Stock L98 06 Z06: Stock LS7 |
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| bogus | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Grand Imperial Pooh-Bah
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The clutch test is simple.
Put the car into 3rd gear. Start as normal. Apply brake and gas at the same time. This will help load the driveline. Slowly release the clutch. If it stalls, well, good, if not, bad. |
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Posted on: 2009/6/1 1:14
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The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me |
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| jhammons01 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
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Hydraulics....MC would be my bet. What you describe is what led me to finally change out the MC...not that I didn't try to get around it....
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Posted on: 2009/6/1 1:56
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| Dale1990 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
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I flushed out the old black fluid and there is no change. It still doesn't like to shift - down shifting is almost impossible.
I did the clutch test procedure bogus mentioned and the car didn't die. I may have been hitting the gas a little hard, tho, since I'm not used to driving this car. The throttle is really touchy and a PITA to drive - 58mm on a SR'ed 383. It seems like the hydraulics are the most likely problem. How do I tell if it is the Master or Slave that is kaput? When I was flushing, I took off the slave and I didn't see any fluid on or near the piston. Thanks! |
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Posted on: 2009/6/7 22:43
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| bogus | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Grand Imperial Pooh-Bah
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Well... with that test, what was the RPM like? I would suspect the clutch at this point.
If anything is bad, history indicates the slave, but its really hard to be sure. |
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Posted on: 2009/6/8 0:50
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The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me |
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| Dale1990 | Re: More clutch woes... | ||
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Senior Guru
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Quote:
Probably 2k maybe up to 2.5k - like I said, the throttle is a biatch to control off-idle normally much less trying to heel-toe. The clutch slipped but the car started moving - quite quickly I might add. Just as a point of note, this car can launch from a normal stop in 3rd with very little difficulty or slipping. I paid more attention to the engagement point this time and it appears to be the same as the 90 which works fine. What is the reasoning behind blaming the shifting difficulty on a slipping clutch? I don't follow this one. Quote:
I'll check around locally and see who has a decent slave. I'd rather exhaust other options before dropping the transmission. Dad and I did this one before and I would rather not do it again. |
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Posted on: 2009/6/8 2:20
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