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| pappyfreebird | 84 z51 headlight | ||
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left headlight came up n flopped back n forth like dint know ifn should stay out er nawt..turnt em on n off couple times n then werked nermal..has happind couple times lately..any tips befoe i go fuggan thins up???seems to come up right but like a stop ain right er the likes...
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Posted on: 2009/7/16 13:03
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| Matatk | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Sounds like it's time to rebuild the headlight motor gears.
Matthew |
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Posted on: 2009/7/16 13:22
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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yeah, sometimes there are bad spots on the larger white gear.
Understand pappy, there is a screw gear attached to the motor, then there are two "barrel" type gears...a larger off white colored one and a smaller black one. The Screw gear contacts the larger white one and sometimes that twisting action grinds the teeth off the MIDDLE section of the white one. They are both plastic but it seems the large white one gets the abuse. That coupled with the way these are designed to stop.....by a voltage spike when the light bucket hits the limiters...it is bound to grind down sooner of later. Order JUST the large white gear "about $23" and then take apart your headlight assemble....it takes about an hour to do the whole job....even at a slow pace. |
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Posted on: 2009/7/16 14:23
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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thanks bros,,so prayun ain gonna solve it fer me is it... in searchin i see a metal gear set up ,,but prolly jus do plastic again ifn lasted this long,,er mebee its nawt the gear but the stop..it comes up fine but then like goes back down n up ,,like dont know what ta do..turn on off couple times n then its fine..n could be fine fer 10 nights then up down up down again,,what stops it in up poistion? i need ta have me a look see..mebee a limtier er stop switch is the prolem..ok back ta prayun fer cheap easy fix..hey sounds like me cheap n easy
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Posted on: 2009/7/16 15:00
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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^^There is no limit switch. Voltage feed back is what a relay looks for.
Look at it this way.....The motor runs along and pulls "X" amount of power.....when the bucket swings around and it hits the rubber bumper and stops the motor.....the motor fights back and during this split second it starts pulling more power to fight with..... A relay see's this power increase by the motor and turns off the whole circuit....simple huh?? no adjusting of limit switches etc. The large plastic white gear has a section of say....15% of the teeth ground off......so when your screw motor comes around to that section......and hits the rubber stopper at the same moment......you get a slipping and your headlight bucket flops around...then you close it and the gears sort of rotate away from that magic spot..... Your good until the combination of gears meet again at that magic spot..... Once you open gears up, you'll easily understand what I am saying.....it's hard to imagine a screw gear and a big gear and how they rotate etc....but when you see it opened up...it all makes sense. Then you see the large white gear with only a small section of teeth ground off.....that part leaves me wondering how/why does that occur. 80% of the gear will be untouched and just that one section is ground off. I wish I had that gear.....I threw away two that looked just the same......two years ago?? |
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Posted on: 2009/7/16 15:20
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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put like that brutha its easy ta unnerstand,,thanks..she be jus like a armeture in a way..may werk then in right spot click click heyhuh..thanks j mayun..now where do i gits me a 23 buck gear...we talkin gm part er aftermarket sum wheres..now thats a tech explainin werth savin (specially fer a foo like me ..ta read like seven thirteen mo times...them gears stoppin in jus the right spots is like starters n ringears to i rekon..thanks again mayun paps
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Posted on: 2009/7/17 0:30
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| Matatk | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Skip the bronze gear and get the plastic one. They are available at any of the parts houses - ecklers, midamerica, corvette central, etc.
Matthew |
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Posted on: 2009/7/17 2:16
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| MK 82 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Shore duz make muh ole ayes hurt whun aye trize ta make sum senz outta yore writinz.
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Posted on: 2009/7/17 5:08
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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wussup dropt,,fug me bro thought ya were my interpriter..hows it been hangin mayun??
on the gears thanks guys i found em at ecklars etc. like ya said..ecklars is cheapest at 21.99 next techie ? is /what did they change that sill protectors are fer dif groups of years in c4s..why 84-87 etc n mo impotently kin the 88 sets be made ta fit n look good on n 84? |
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Posted on: 2009/7/17 13:14
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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DropTop......it does no good, We tried to get Pappy to change...but he is who he is and it's all good. We just learn to accept and live together. Pappy is gud peepl.... |
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Posted on: 2009/7/17 14:34
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Quote:
The later years are completely different set-ups. So all the advice I give you would never work for a later style headlight assembly. The Early years lose that large white gear....the later years lose the bushings that hold a Single white gear in place......so the advice is completely different depending on the year. I'd point you to a Tech article that has a how too on this....When I tried to use it step by step....it was taking forever and things did not make sense...I had to read and re-read what they were trying to say...... I became frustrated and just started looking at the assembly. Common sense had the assembly out in about 15 minutes..... |
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Posted on: 2009/7/17 14:39
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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yea bro my mind is clear like at..the readin kin fug me up..no duh heyhuh!!!..but my techie ? was sill protectors..why change c4s fum 84-87 n so on..could a 88 set be made ta fit 84..dont need but cheap n cool..but fer 88 n up n im in a 84
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Posted on: 2009/7/18 2:10
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Here is the only tips you need.
Unhook the power to the motor. Twist the rubber thing on teh bottom of the motor to rotate the bucket. There are Torx screws exposed at that time. Take them off and remove all the painted things and set them aside so they don't get scratched. Then just using your eyes to see what is holding the bucket in place, remove the bolts. There is a "Question mark" looking bracket that holds every thing and there is a few bolts that hold the motor. The "Question Mark bracket" is attached directly to the hood. The wires run through it... Once you get all that loose the whole bucket comes out. Then separate the motor from the bucket. Using the screws on the side, Open the motor up. Careful not to let the motor itself come out of the housing or the brushes could get damaged. Lift the large white gear out....there are these lead things in the slots.....move them to the new gear and drop it back in the same spot the old cam out......put it all back together. Go to the other side of the hood and repeat the process. I promise you the first one will take you 2 hours where the second one will take you 20 minutes. |
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Posted on: 2009/7/18 16:56
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| MK 82 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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No offense Pappy but the dialect is ammusing for awhile but it gets old when you have to read the post 5 times to decipher it. How about the dialect for a hello and then regular English?
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Posted on: 2009/7/19 3:58
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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well had debated on orderin two,,n this morn i gits my answer,,right side flopped a couple times..so j mayun n peoples i be orderin two i rekon...(was gonna anyways but ony do the one,,,now oh well heyhuh
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Posted on: 2009/7/20 11:42
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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The funny thing about it is, They seem to "go" at that same time....within months of each other.
So yeah, order two of the larger white ones. |
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Posted on: 2009/7/20 14:57
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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did bro ..55.13 total @ ecklers...thanks ..now jus hope my 8lb sledge packs nuff wallop ta git the lights out on the floor so i kin put in them gears....
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Posted on: 2009/7/20 19:18
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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ok rednecks i rekon im the dork boy again..id had a lil time sosin i pulled right side light n motor out (purty easy thanks jmayun) but i git the dink award fer i pulled the sidegear cover n looked n said aw fug this gear is to fuggan big..outta time a flung it back tagather..now once have a few secs. ta think n lookin in ecklers book n reread jamos advice..i thought mebee pulled wrong cover (side cover verses motor cover) but thar gear is biggar then any case in my units,,sosin i figure i may have a newr style motor awready..looks like 88-96 set up in ecks pix..wud say rednecks..
Attach file:  gear 001.jpg (0.00 KB) gear 002.jpg (0.00 KB) |
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Posted on: 2009/8/4 19:36
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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well since i mebee awready detirmind i have 88-90 motors..now i ask wud makes that year of motors do the headlight jumpies,,ony did once each side,,but hey..well i kin return these gears(awready pd cc too dayum it)but mebee exchange fer the right stuff should you boy know wud i sayun...do i now need them 3 lil spacer thingies to replace facorty jel??? the whit side gear (bout 2 3/8 ths looked good fer wud i could see..
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Posted on: 2009/8/4 20:24
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| Fluff | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Excuse me sticking my nose in, theres a few write up's on the net about the subject, but this link has some good description and pics of that type motor/actuator:-
http://www.corvetteclub.org.uk/files/ ... ding_headlight_motors.pdf |
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Posted on: 2009/8/4 21:01
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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yo fluff!!thats a tits deal there mayun....thats werth savin ..n proves ta me i have newer style motors..n is zactly wud i need to do...anybody care ta convert mm to dough head ..so i knows wud sixe hard plastic i be lookin fer..well fer 5 a set of 3 i think ill jus order me sum (ony since i be returnin my earlier order)..again dude great article thanks paps
hey mods this be a great rag ta hang ina tech library heyhuh |
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Posted on: 2009/8/4 21:14
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| Fluff | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Good, hope it helps pappy.
The bushes are available at the usual outlets (pre-sizes and cheap). If you do get stuck, shout and I'll see if I have any rod left from when I followed the write... will stick in the post for you. Good luck. |
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Posted on: 2009/8/4 22:11
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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rekon we need ta note that my 84 seems to have been updated to the newer 88-96 motors....this article is perfuct fer newer styles,,84 -87 would still take the gear ,,talked on by jmayun...thank again peoples..i be returnin my gears n askin fer the 3 pc set a round stock n sum money back fum ecklers..so saga continues to nuthar day,,when parts arive
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Posted on: 2009/8/5 17:28
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Damn! I feel bad for steering you wrong....and yes you have the newer style motors.
Of course why would you bother to pull then out until you got the replacement part in hand......sux for all of us I guess. Someone will need those gears. be patient....someone will paypal you money for them. |
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Posted on: 2009/8/5 18:17
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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yo jammo...dont evin feel a weenie bit bayud bro..ya helped me all the way..i coulda looked lil closer befoe yappin too...no unhappys fum me..now i know how they kick out n i know i have n upgrade plus i gots the answer ta why my kids trans am winds on as it do (bettin same type motor) fact purty sure it is.jus sent my gears back fer credit n odered the roller deals..so thanks again rednecks.. paps
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Posted on: 2009/8/5 20:55
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| Fluff | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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You may or may not be able to visual when the rollers go in the late type.
When mine started playing up you could see a little pile of creamy-white granules on the main chassis rails under the motors. They just disintergrate and spew out the remnants! |
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Posted on: 2009/8/5 21:14
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| MK 82 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Where does one get these current sensing relays. I have never seen such an animal.
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Posted on: 2009/8/6 21:00
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| Matatk | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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I don't believe it's actually the relay that senses the draw, but rather the headlight module. Matthew |
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Posted on: 2009/8/7 2:16
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| MK 82 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Exactly my point.
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Posted on: 2009/8/7 17:30
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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So tell me, why would the motor stop trying to spin after a while???
I know where you are going with the line of questioning.... there is "something" that senses the voltage spike and tells the motor to stop. You tell me what it is and we'll all be better off for it won't we?? You may have a better way of explaining it to Pappy, I was just trying to let him know that there aren't "limit switches" to be triggered or set or adjusted. |
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Posted on: 2009/8/8 2:24
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| Fluff | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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I could be totally wrong on this, I read up on it once, but can't find the info anymore!.
However, the 'something' that senses the spike is, as has been said, the 'headlight module' which is a solid state device, so I'd guess that this module controls both the logic signal (power spike in this case) and the voltage switching to the H/L's. I seem to recall (I may be wrong), that pre-89's also utilised an over-load relay in the circuit which was 'thermal' sensitive to the power 'spike'. I wonder with pappies hybred if there are any other components that needed changing to accomodate the later motors... so there could be some guess work involved. Just my thoughts, correct me if I'm wrong. |
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Posted on: 2009/8/8 10:54
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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yo fluff you say 6x12mm rods..do you mean 6 rods 12x12mm ..they look equal in legnth n diametar..n ifn 12mm is 1/2" (ony gittun this info off a staple box but sez 12mm-1/2" buy 3/16ths etc dig.. but ifn correct that makes 6mm bout 1/4" n again them pieces look equal///\\
also again id ask that this wunnerful tech article git shtuffed in r tech library ..great info fer newbies n foos like me n then wouldnt hafta search n ask ..itd be there fer all ta see...ain that wud librays is fer..heyhuh..thanks ps n seeyin jhamos werds above id rekon he made it perfuclty clear thanks bro..n fer them that treat as a foo fer my typin my bet be i could stand beside most when tearin sumthin down..(makin it werk is nuthar story wahahaha ya fuggars) but do unnerstand that a simple relay once activated kin trip n stop magnetic force thus killin thru juice tell renergized..either way thanks jamo n fluff n rest..big thougth was how to adjust the stop n since ain any ya cant n thats wud was explained so la la la fa la la la laaaa ,,so now we re inta repairin them rigs..again great help bros |
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Posted on: 2009/8/13 1:03
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| Fluff | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Quote:
Pappy, When I followed the instructions, I bought the 12mm (dia) rod and if memory is working it was about a foot long. All I did was to measure the depth inside the gear (where the rod/bushes will sit) and this worked out (on my gears) to be around 12mm. So I cut 6 (two motors) 12mm long pieces off of the rod... so I finished up with each bush 12mm dia x 12mm long. If your buying rod locally (instead of the pre-cut bushes), I reckon 1/2" will be just as good, if not better... just make sure it fits in the gear cut-outs. Hope thats some help. |
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Posted on: 2009/8/13 13:36
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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thank you bro..again yous cats is the best mayun...i have a barrel of (plastic) type shapes n sizes donated to r machine shop that closed now n was gonna have me a look see..mebee do the idjut test like cut on it drag it on sandpaper see how tuff is ,,,since i ain no plastics expert..rekon its of the cutting board material makin it tuff nuff wouldnt ya think..thanks again bros
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Posted on: 2009/8/13 14:48
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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well ain chure wud ya call it..id call it plastic rod..mics at 1/2" n knife wont scratcher cut inta it n knife stone i used ta sharin wid wont damage it n hacksawin it inta 1' long was like cuttin steel..so a hicks test would say plenty hard nuff i rekon...so sum rainy day ill see wud i kin fug up..wont take any pix ,,,cause ya cant beat whats awready been presented
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Posted on: 2009/8/13 17:15
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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ok well do rekon its writtun that ecklers lady reemd me fer sendin back request to exchange parts (there reciept had the form) so i told her that ,,,n she said well they dont accept that ,,i sez well update yer cheeyut then lady i r a newbee..anyways all was corrected by them..ceptin i decided nawt order ...thanks ta fluf id make me own..well few daze ago i gits package wid the said rollers that she wouldnt send n im stupid fer using there enclosed form(dipsticks shouldnt send it then)anyways a lil miffed that they would say that n later jus send them n charge me..should a called n beeyuched em out.. but 15 buck i say fug it..they bettar nawt jus decide ta send me new motor n charge my card!!..well bored taday so used there parts..next is sum pix
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Posted on: 2009/8/30 20:35
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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1 the powder fluf refered to
2 wuds left a rollers n cleaned up gears 3 wud rollers shoulda looked like 4 shows drift pin removal,,but also the stop the jamo was explainin 5 finishun 2nd motor,,also showin sum futare rollers id jus sized n cut ,,n remains of 6 rollers in piles of dust.. they werk great (sons 95 trans am makes same run on noise) so bet same repair..total time 1.5 hrs includin make a set of futare replacements...thanks jamo n fluff ya made this painless...wish ecklers would have.. Attach file: light motor 8.jpg (0.00 KB) light motor 6.jpg (0.00 KB) light motor 7.jpg (0.00 KB) light motor4.jpg (0.00 KB) light motor2.jpg (0.00 KB) |
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Posted on: 2009/8/30 20:48
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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also a note ony loosend armeture adj. bolt 2 turns ta free gear...but as puttin second motor tagtha i see this lil ball..mmmm fug yea bruthas..it sumhow sliped out wid out takin the adj bolt evin out..so careful careful...heres a pic of it back in place..(id counted turns to remove complete n put back in same)
thanks again bruthas n thanks site rednecks fer runnin it n lettin me hang Attach file: light motor.jpg (0.00 KB) |
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Posted on: 2009/8/30 20:53
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| jhammons01 | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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Good job on the Pics Pappy.....We should get Bogus to translate redneck and make this a Sticky thread.
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Posted on: 2009/9/1 15:32
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| pappyfreebird | Re: 84 z51 headlight | ||
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thanks fer the help jamo..i rekon i did suggest that ,,er um to put it in tech library..easy to look up help fer next time er newerbee then me.
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Posted on: 2009/9/8 15:24
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