jsup wrote:
So, it's really hard to find anyone to tune one of these cars. Blowerworks is local, and I went to Greg to talk about fixing my base tune.

This guy is good, really good. He custom built a simulator to replicate the motor running to test and adjust chip tuning. Basically you can set the simulator as if the motor was running at, say 3324 RPMs, just turn a dial. You can take it in and out of closed loop, you can slam the pedal down to TPS 100%. All that from the simulator.

Here's the custom made tuning apparatus, I am fairly confident that none like this exists in the world:

jsup wrote:

What I find amazing is that he is a F.A.S.T dealer. He says that the STOCK 90 COMPUTER in my car is superior in every way to the F.A.S.T systems.

jsup wrote:

Now, don't jump all over me because I'm still learning, however, according to Greg, you can better tweak across the entire RPM range with the stock computer as long as you use the PULSE WIDTH HACK. Supposedly, he paid someone to write the hack for him

jsup wrote:

The F.A.S.T system he says is good for single purpose vehicles, but for a street car, nothing better than a stock computer.

jsup wrote:

Can you possibly imagine the hell I'd pay if I said that on some other forums? That's blasphemy in some places,

jsup wrote:

Anyway, I digress, I took the car out to a local show today, the sound certainly turned heads, lots of thumbs up and stares as I rolled in. Greg's initial tune bought the water temp down by about 40 degrees, the best I can tell, and repaired the off the line stumble I was experiencing. I am going to his shop tomorrow, on Sunday, and we're going to do more tweaking. More info to follow


Sorry about the blurry pics, it was taken with my phone.

anesthes wrote:


Actually a few thousand exist in the world. For a while a guy on TGO was selling them.

http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/diy ... m-test-bench-circuit.html

Gregg's looks sorta like Bruce Plecans old one.

I had one for a while but found it rather useless for anything other than testing what custom code would do, and the only thing I was ever really modifying code-wise was the $60 2-bar stuff.

I can agree with that. For the most part.

haha.

Greg is a good tuner. But he isn't a coder.

Guys on TGO wrote the hack years ago. Ludis if I recall, is the first person who dissassembled and documented the $8D code.

Mike Davis then wrote a lot of the wideband stuff for $8D.

I can provide data to back all my statements.

Most guys don't have a clue how this stuff works.

Sounds good.

Question: How is the car from initial start? Can you just fire it up and go or do you have to wait for it to warm up?

Did Greg rescale your MAT counts table for the relocated MAT/IAT sensor?

-- Joe

jsup wrote:

ok, perhaps it's just really cool to me because I've never seen it. He has the stock ECU attached to it, then to an Ostrich, then to a PC. Just pretty cool..

jsup wrote:


Again, this is all new to me, so I'm probably more impressed than I should be. He said he paid a hacker to break the codes. IDK, don't think he's lying...

jsup wrote:

Never stopped them before......have you seen the brochures from FAST? C'mon it's great stuff...

jsup wrote:

I can get it fire it up and go. The problem I'm having is that the power band has flat spots and backfires when I get into it from a roll from time to time.

This tune is better in some ways than the initial, but not as good as others.

We're working on it, I'll be there tomorrow to see what we can figure out. He did a base tune, told me to set the timing to 10* and FP to 45. Put in the chip and see what happens, so, I did.

I may leave the car with him a couple days so he can do the cold start in the morning and stuff.

Hopefully by the time I get this dialed in, I'll understand WTF is going on...

bogus wrote:
I am learning this myself. Greg sounds very knowledgable, too.

I am curious, there are some high tech european engine controllers, MoTEC, Bosch, how do those stack up to a stock ECU?

I can fully understand the need for stock ECU's being so good. They are designed to get a car onto the street; one of the harshest and most demanding environs there is. Consumers are a tough nut to crack, too... they won't tolerate popping and backfiring, to say the least!

jsup wrote:

This guy is good, really good. He custom built a simulator to replicate the motor running to test and adjust chip tuning.

anesthes wrote:
I still think 42s are too big for your application. If the motor was built properly the BSFC should be around .45

That says 38.95# injectors at 43.5psi.

I'm throwing out the number of 550hp at the crank. I'm not convinced it will make that much but it's a good overshoot.

Greg builds a lot of supercharged combos. A supercharged engine making 550hp might have a BSFC of .60 or worse due to heat. 41.25# injectors.


-- Joe

Blade_1 wrote:
Quote:

jsup wrote:

This guy is good, really good. He custom built a simulator to replicate the motor running to test and adjust chip tuning.

So he's pretty good huh?

Can he tune THIS?



Can he tuna this?

jsup wrote:
Here's the update. Greg just dropped me home a few minutes ago. I left the car with him. There is more in the car, we now have it all set up to tune, I'll go back during the week. He wants to put in a heated O2. There's also something smoking, melting, when the engine gets hot smoke comes out....we need to figure out WTF is hitting the exhaust and deal with it.

So.....he has the car ans we'll get to the rest shortly, we're down to the last 10%.

anesthes wrote:
Quote:

jsup wrote:
Here's the update. Greg just dropped me home a few minutes ago. I left the car with him. There is more in the car, we now have it all set up to tune, I'll go back during the week. He wants to put in a heated O2. There's also something smoking, melting, when the engine gets hot smoke comes out....we need to figure out WTF is hitting the exhaust and deal with it.

So.....he has the car ans we'll get to the rest shortly, we're down to the last 10%.

Where is the 02 bung in your headers?

I'm running the hooker long tubes. The 02 is in one of the primaries. I've seen other brands put the 02 really far away.

I need new valve covers. I got some time in today (4th time I've driven the car this year - been busy). My valve covers are leaking though so I hope I get a 5th in..

-- Joe

jsup wrote:


My O2 bung is in the collector. It goes into closed loop, but not at idle. If we rev it to 1500 RPMs at idle, it goes into closed loop. He wants to see closed loop at idle, makes it easier to tune....he's the expert.

jsup wrote:

I have an bung on the other header, should I decide to go to a wideband, I can put it in the other side.

Anyway, we have to solve the smoking problem, before I get to the other issues. The exhaust is hitting something, just don't know what.

jsup wrote:

Your car sounds like my boat. I got about 5 trips in this year, well at least I didn't waste a lot in gas.

anesthes wrote:

Hrmm. To each their own..

I patched my bin so it won't go into closed loop until 1400 RPM. I'd rather run a very lean open loop idle. Cam overlap at idle always ends up in the ECM correcting a rich condition.

Are you using the base map that TPIS did? I wonder if they did the same patch I did.

Not many things to hit that you can't see. ??

I sold my boat this spring for a song. I used it 3 times last year. Been out on the PWC twice this year.

I pass this little bow rider every day on some guys front lawn with a for sale sign.. She keeps telling me "you will never use it".. She's probably right.

-- Joe

bogus wrote:
I prefer to have the O2 on the collector, that way it is getting a full picture of at least the entire bank.

I wish there was a way to do 2 O2s on that vintage.