Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ??? [Forums - C4 Technical]

C4 Technical > Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???
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383tpimachine	Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#1
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	I want to get the man pedal in my vette. Its my autox/DD at the moment so would like to get used to driving it with a stick before hitting a roadcourse. And the better MPG is a plus. Ive heard the LT1 T56 is the way to go as its a push(or pull) setup. The one I need in other words. Is this a fairly easy swap? I know Ill need the trans, slave, clutch, flywheel, and DS. Am I missing anything? Is there a better trans to go with? Would like to stay away from Zf6
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 1:04
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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Matatk	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#2
Webmaster SW Chicago Burbs 22807 Posts Member since: 2008/1/7 0:00	Look at Joe's page: http://members.cisdi.com/~anesthes/
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 1:08
	_________________ 2002 EBM convertible, Magnusson supercharger, cam, headers, etc. 1989 Corvette...RIP
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vetteoz	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#3
Senior Guru 453 Posts Member since: 2007/8/6 0:00	Quote: 383tpimachine wrote: Ive heard the LT1 T56 is the way to go as its a push(or pull) setup. Would like to stay away from Zf6 http://www.prostreetcustoms.net/CorvettePage.html
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 1:24

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BrianCunningham	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#4
Senior Guru Boston, MA for the most part :) 7763 Posts Member since: 2007/12/30 0:00	Why don't you like the ZF6?
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 1:43
	_________________ Polo Green 95 LT1 6-spd http://mysite.verizon.net/vzevcp74/ 383 LT1/Vortech Supercharger/AFR heads/Rod end suspension/Penske-Hardbar dual rate coilovers/Wilwood 6pot brakes NCCC Governor: http://BayStateCorvetteClub.com
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#5
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	I have read they charge an arm and a leg for some of their parts and availability. The T56 is abundant and what I would like to go with but am open to other options. Thanks everyone
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 1:59
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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Josh	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#6
Guru Raleigh, NC 666 Posts Member since: 2008/1/1 0:00	Quote: BrianCunningham wrote: Why don't you like the ZF6? There's a ton of reasons. It's loud, the parts are hard to find, the hydraulic systems for the clutch suck, the failing hydraulics will wear out the syncros in a hurry, there is only a couple places you can get them rebuilt, those places are expensive, the shifter uses external linkage (how ancient can you get?), shifter swaps are a 2 hour ordeal as opposed to 10 minutes or less on other ball/socket shifter applications, it's heavy (175 lbs or so), has tremendously limited clutch options, the fluid is great mystery as to what to use, and about a billion other things. Quite literally the only positive thing about it is that it is so strong.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 3:19
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#7
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	Strong? What do they hold up to stock? The T56 can handle 500rwhp very easily so taking into account I will never be over 550 It should last.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 3:35
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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bogus	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#8
Grand Imperial Pooh-Bah San Pedro, CA 20859 Posts Member since: 2005/9/7 0:00	A stock ZF6 black tag can stand upwards of 650hp. Don't be so sure that a T56 will last... they don't take abuse well. Just ask the fbody guys.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 3:57
	_________________ The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#9
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	How much does a black tag ZF6 run? and what clutches are good for roadracing
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 4:35
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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Churchkey	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#10
Guru 69 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:01	Have a low mileage t56 for sale.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 13:01

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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#11
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	Lt1 or ls1?
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 15:40
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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bogus	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#12
Grand Imperial Pooh-Bah San Pedro, CA 20859 Posts Member since: 2005/9/7 0:00	Are there differences re: LT1 vs LS1 installed T56? I know the bolt up pattern is the same. Black Tag cost? You will have to check that one. I really like the RAM clutch conversion with the hydrualic throwout bearing.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 17:38
	_________________ The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place. - George Bernard Shaw Education is the best tool to overcome irrational fear. - me
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Dale1990	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#13
Senior Guru Conway, AR 128 Posts Member since: 2008/10/23 15:28	Look around for prices as they can vary wildly. I picked up an 90 L98 engine with black tag ZF6 for $1k late last year. Even got a B&M shifter with it which should be interesting. When I was looking I'd see some for much lower and others for higher.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 18:04
	_________________ 86 Coupe: SR 383 90 Convertible: Stock L98 06 Z06: Stock LS7
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#14
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	Quote: bogus wrote: Are there differences re: LT1 vs LS1 installed T56? I know the bolt up pattern is the same. One is a pull one is a push style clutch setup The LT1 is the same as the ZF6 (dont know is its push or pull) Im thinking of this as a winter/summer project depending on funds. I just dont like doing autox and coming out of a corner in the wrong gear/rpm. Plus i want to learn to "Drive"
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 18:29
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#15
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	If you don't want a ZF6, then you are only left with difficult answers. Anyhow the ZF has a stupid clutch setup. Next time mine fails I may try the hydraulic throwout bearing and push type clutch swap. Others have tried, but nobody liked it enough to recommend it. If you upgrade the clutch, a better friction disc is ok, but I do NOT recommend the upgraded pressure plate, as extra spring force or weights will just cause the crappy throwout bearing to fail sooner. Some of the clutch cylinders out there are garbage also, but the cast steel ones seem to last. Other than the shitty pull-clutch and the noise, I see no drawbacks. Replacement costs aren't an issue if it doesn't break. The shift feel is great with a short shifter. There's no such thing as a trans with internal shifter that will fit the vette, unless you want to reach under your stereo to shift. And if you have to have a quiet transmission, maybe you're more the minivan type of guy.
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 23:06
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#16
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	Quote: 383tpimachine wrote: Quote: bogus wrote: Are there differences re: LT1 vs LS1 installed T56? I know the bolt up pattern is the same. One is a pull one is a push style clutch setup The LT1 is the same as the ZF6 (dont know is its push or pull) I think Andy is asking about the F-body LT1. Didn't they use a hydraulic throwout bearing in those with push clutch?
	Posted on: 2010/7/21 23:10
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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LD85	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#17
Master Guru Indianapolis, Indiana 784 Posts Member since: 2005/9/16 0:00	Quote: Josh wrote: Quote: BrianCunningham wrote: Why don't you like the ZF6? There's a ton of reasons. It's loud, the parts are hard to find, the hydraulic systems for the clutch suck, the failing hydraulics will wear out the syncros in a hurry, there is only a couple places you can get them rebuilt, those places are expensive, the shifter uses external linkage (how ancient can you get?), shifter swaps are a 2 hour ordeal as opposed to 10 minutes or less on other ball/socket shifter applications, it's heavy (175 lbs or so), has tremendously limited clutch options, the fluid is great mystery as to what to use, and about a billion other things. Quite literally the only positive thing about it is that it is so strong. ding, ding, ding ,ding,, yes, yes & yes I admit the ZF is strong, I admit that the ZF is better if you drive 75mph or faster consistently on the interstate... I also admit, the ZF clutch is expensive, limited in terms of options & simply pathetic, the hydraulics are marginal,,, and the noise is an acquired taste,,
	Posted on: 2010/7/22 2:05
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FATED	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#18
Guru Newb Texas 157 Posts Member since: 2007/12/30 0:00	There was a lot of information on the ZF6 swap a couple of years back. This should be archived and found by searching ZF6 swap. I did this and got a lot of help from the good people at this web site. To me the only draw back is the gear knock at idle. I just keep the clutch disengaged at stop lights. You may have troble finding the thick pressure plate and will have to use the long pivot post. Its not a hole lot of work it is more or less a bolt in project.
	Posted on: 2010/8/3 16:20
	_________________ 1985, Performance Chip, hole in muffler, and other Mods
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#19
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	You guys are missing the point. The BIGGEST benefit to the ZF6 is it fits. If the T56 is so great, why haven't you put one in there and fabricated a custom shifter and center console for it?
	Posted on: 2010/8/3 16:42
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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FATED	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#20
Guru Newb Texas 157 Posts Member since: 2007/12/30 0:00	I posted earlier that you could find the ZF6 swap info by search. I see that you can't search back that far any more. Check out the web sit posted earlier in this thread. It has all the information without the good pictures.
	Posted on: 2010/8/4 2:57
	_________________ 1985, Performance Chip, hole in muffler, and other Mods
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#21
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	Yeah, at some point I need to document it better, before I forget it all.
	Posted on: 2010/8/4 4:22
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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Matatk	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#22
Webmaster SW Chicago Burbs 22807 Posts Member since: 2008/1/7 0:00	Quote: FATED wrote: I posted earlier that you could find the ZF6 swap info by search. I see that you can't search back that far any more. Check out the web sit posted earlier in this thread. It has all the information without the good pictures. You mean this one? http://www.corvette-guru.com/modules/ ... pe=&topic_id=3809&forum=1
	Posted on: 2010/8/4 13:31
	_________________ 2002 EBM convertible, Magnusson supercharger, cam, headers, etc. 1989 Corvette...RIP
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#23
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	Yeah, that's the best thread we have on here about it.
	Posted on: 2010/8/4 16:24
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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biggrizzly	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#24
2011 Memorial Day Car Show Winner! Chesapeake Beach, Maryland 4543 Posts Member since: 2006/4/23 0:00	Does the PCM have to be changed out with this swap if you are going from A4 to Manual? Also, would the Dana36 have to be swapped out for the 44? Is this a worthwhile swap if your A4 is worn out?
	Posted on: 2010/8/4 17:46
	_________________ Don Haller Corvette Club of America 94Coupe, 383Stroka, PeteK Trans, 3000stall, 3.54rear, Konis and bigger sways.
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#25
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	Quote: biggrizzly wrote: Does the PCM have to be changed out with this swap if you are going from A4 to Manual? Also, would the Dana36 have to be swapped out for the 44? Is this a worthwhile swap if your A4 is worn out? PCM doesnt control shifts like on a 4l60e so I would assume not. Im doing the swap since its my cruiser, autox, and roadrace car. Cant do the racing well without a stick. THe D36 will work as thats what im using. I just cant launch it hard and blow it up. I plan on a beefed up D44 3.55 when the D36 3.08 grenades
	Posted on: 2010/8/4 21:58
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#26
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	The D36 and beam can be used, just swap a ZF6 driveshaft yoke onto your D36 driveshaft (it's longer than the D44 shaft). Worthwhile? Find one and drive one, the decision will be easy.
	Posted on: 2010/8/5 8:19
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#27
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	One thing that hasn't been mentioned here is the rear end gear. The ZF6 has a .050 overdrive, so anything less than a 3.33 rear gear is going to be ridiculous with it. This is one place where the ZF might cost you extra depending on what you've got already. I'd recommend a 3.55. My 3.45 is a tad too tall, but works well with a L98 or stroker I guess. Otherwise it's basically a 5-speed with a useless 6th gear. I shift at 15, 25, 35, 45, and 65 mph. 6th at 65 is ok if you're just feathering the throttle, otherwise you have to be going 70+ to use it.
	Posted on: 2010/8/5 8:21
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#28
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	Quote: CentralCoaster wrote: One thing that hasn't been mentioned here is the rear end gear. The ZF6 has a .050 overdrive, so anything less than a 3.33 rear gear is going to be ridiculous with it. This is one place where the ZF might cost you extra depending on what you've got already. I'd recommend a 3.55. My 3.45 is a tad too tall, but works well with a L98 or stroker I guess. Otherwise it's basically a 5-speed with a useless 6th gear. I shift at 15, 25, 35, 45, and 65 mph. 6th at 65 is ok if you're just feathering the throttle, otherwise you have to be going 70+ to use it. Most Fbody t56 guys go with a 4.10. I wouldnt go over 3.73 tho for a highway pull ability lol
	Posted on: 2010/8/5 17:32
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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CentralCoaster	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#29
Senior Guru San Diego, CA 9454 Posts Member since: 2007/10/28 0:00	Yeah, those'll work, but I have plenty out of the hole, I really don't need 4.10s on it too, and I like to cruise fast on the freeway and sip gas.
	Posted on: 2010/8/5 18:57
	_________________ 1985 Z51, ZF6
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383tpimachine	Re: Anyone done a 6 speed swap? T56 or ???	#30
Master Guru Corpus Christi 976 Posts Member since: 2009/7/25 19:07	Quote: CentralCoaster wrote: Yeah, those'll work, but I have plenty out of the hole, I really don't need 4.10s on it too, and I like to cruise fast on the freeway and sip gas. When this 383 lets go I plan on building another one with 4 bolt mains and a lil healthier cam and 6500rpm redline so I think 3.73 will be the best medium. 5200rpm redline runs out pretty quick even with 3.08s
	Posted on: 2010/8/5 20:09
	_________________ 1985 Atomic Orange 400YSIT56-Racecar build 1970 El Camino-Awaiting LSX
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